VAtoGA on 9/29/2008 6:49:00 PM wrote:
Thank God there is something to read on here other than The Walker/ Bill Hudson show, thanks scandals!
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scandals on 9/29/2008 4:17:10 PM wrote:
18 to 20 million??? What does it have gold plated walls or something? Why don't they just give it to Ed Walker or Carilion so they can exclude the majority of Roanokers.
Or maybe we could take half of that money and build a kick ass amphlitheatre down by the river...above the flood plain. Then maybe we could get some good bands that have recorded material after 1970. But what fun would that be to actually succeed at something. Instead, maybe we should make it a gay art exhibit or something...i mean that really packs them in.
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herewegoagain on 4/9/2008 1:23:09 AM wrote:
The YMCA serves kids of all beliefs -- or at least, it did last time I was there.
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Travelguy on 4/8/2008 9:02:27 AM wrote:
The revised plans look better. It seems the market vendors are pleased as well. The improvements to Center are vital for downtown and the focal point for visitors to Roanoke. Funding this project is another story during bad economic times. My question is "Why does the YMCA need money from the City"? Since the Y is a Christian organization, can't the Churches help fund their programs rather than the citizens of Roanoke City?
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TripleActionJones on 3/31/2008 10:16:25 AM wrote:
There is also a parking garage on Church Avenue(across from Trio Restaurant) that's under reconstruction right now and will provide hundreds of more parking spaces upon completion.
I don't normally have too hard fo a time finding a decent parking space downtown.
You just have to realize that you can't pull up right in front of every store you wish to visit. Never had to walk more than a couple blocks from where I needed to be though, if that.
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Entropy on 3/28/2008 3:52:35 PM wrote:
ok thats what i thought. i thought maybe in those weird hours im not actually downtown the parking spots were filled with homeless people, or perhaps people were upset they couldn't fit their Ford Explosion's in the spaces or something.
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roenoke on 3/28/2008 2:29:20 PM wrote:
There is no parking problem, just lazy people.
I have never had trouble finding parking downtown.
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Entropy on 3/28/2008 2:17:10 PM wrote:
I still don't see the "parking problem" I have never once had a problem parking downtown, during the business day, in the evenings when the clubs are packed, or on a weekend.
Seriously, what's the problem? People too fat to walk from the Church St. Garages? They're never full! I'm fat and I walk it. it's not that bad.
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TripleActionJones on 3/27/2008 10:22:59 AM wrote:
I don't think what they have proposed are too bad of ideas.
Didn't like the idea of the Weiner Stand being moved but it will still be highly visible and I don't think it will be in danger of going out of business.
Also, the owner seems okay with it so I would place some trust in that.
Considering some of the other,crazier ideas they have floated around concerning the vendors and the Square, I think these are some of the better ideas to be placed forth.
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Travelguy on 3/27/2008 9:59:51 AM wrote:
Not too exciting in my opinion so far. I liked the concept of more indoor market stalls and a continuation of the food items, as well as more restaurants. These are money makers! If more cultural venues are envisioned then lets think more about trolleys that carry people from this area to the Transportation Museum. Oh yes, how about another Hotel in the Market area, with parking!!!
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Thumper on 3/27/2008 9:12:42 AM wrote:
Is our community willing to support the updates needed in the science museum exhibits? Are you willing to volunteer your time and money? Do we want a science-literate society?
Kudos to the museum staff ! Thank you for your dedication and perseverance.
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Thumper on 3/27/2008 9:05:18 AM wrote:
My children have benefited from the programs at the science museum for years. Have yours? Have you seen children excited about learning as they take part in the summer camps? I have.
Have you seen the science museum educators carting HUGE science outreach tubs along the sidewalks on the market? I have.
Have you seen children in local public school classrooms excited about science as the museum educators present in-class lessons? I have. (In fact, would ike to see the science museum educators in my child's science class all the time...the SOL review worksheets are getting OLD! I digress.
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Thumper on 3/27/2008 8:51:18 AM wrote:
inthezoneguy on 3/27/2008 8:38:51 AM wrote:
Let me think.....the Transportation Museum(TM) is is in financial trouble and the Center in the Square (Science Museum, History Museum)(SM, HM) is squeeking by.
coverfelt on 3/22/2007 1:56:39 PM wrote:
Maybe the science museum needs to spend money updating the attractions instead on..."
LET ME THINK: Maybe coverfelt and inthezoneguy can make a
$15 X 10( 6th power) donation to the science museum! Then, the museum could be named the "IN THE ZONE SCIENCE GUY or possibly, "SCIENCE COVERS it ALL" ...the last one was a bit diificult as I am seing a little red right now!
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inthezoneguy on 3/27/2008 8:38:51 AM wrote:
Let me think.....the Transportation Museum(TM) is is in financial trouble and the Center in the Square (Science Museum, History Museum)(SM, HM) is squeeking by. The Art Museum is bailing out of the Center in the Square. What is the unique feature of the "market area" that draws tourists and customers?
My suggestions are this: Have the Board of Directors of the TM, SM and HM work together to construct a brand new modern facility that the organizations share. Convert the Center into specialty vendor space. Upgrade or rebuild the Market Building. Close the streets off to vehicular traffic from Jefferson to Williamson for pedestrian and bicycle traffic only. Maintain all of the current vendors and welcome some new opportunities. Simple.
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tbajen on 3/22/2007 10:04:22 PM wrote:
Gee, let me think of how stupid it would be to get rid of half of the vendors on the market. The last time I went to Center in the Square I was 11 years old and still in Girl Scouts. Twenty-two years later, I go to the market regularly to shop for produce and flowers. I guess the traffic the vendors bring to the market aren't good enough. Why can't the museum look at some of the other empty buildings downtown and relocate? I just don't understand the direction the city is going. First we want to desicrate Mill Mountain with a lodge, now a market without vendors. What next???
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coverfelt on 3/22/2007 1:56:39 PM wrote:
What a loss it would be to loose the vendors. I do not know anyone who goes to the market area just for the museum, they go for the vendors. The museum has to rely on donations to make their budget now. Maybe the science museum needs to spend money updating the attractions instead on throwing out what is bring business to downtown. I work downtown and love to walk around the area and buy from the vendors, whether is is flowers, plants or lunch. What the market needs is more vendors stalls especially since in the spring, summer and fall it is usually full. So what if for 2 months the area is slow, what happens in the other seasons makes up for it. I think if the Center does this there will be less visitors to their attraction. THINK!
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billpeek on 3/22/2007 1:04:37 PM wrote:
When I come to Roanoke from my home in Winston-Salem, the Market is the first place I head to after the Grandin Theatre. The whole plan sounds ill-conceived; if large numbers of people do not care to visit the Center building now, it is unlikely that a fancier building will attract them. Further, the very notion of telling the Weenie Stand to move is ludicrous. It's like telling the Texas Tavern that it must move to Franklin Road or some such place.
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Travelguy on 3/22/2007 12:01:30 PM wrote:
Downtown Roanoke is currently losing its
status as a destination. I don't feel enough is being done to encourage more unique housing, office/hotel/retail developments. We need a new direction such as the new market square project to encourage such growth. Lets all embrace these new ideas as Roanoke has too much invested in that area to see it go into decline once again.
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kharris1970 on 3/22/2007 11:51:17 AM wrote:
Center in the Square was PART of what revitalized the Market in the 1980's, but was not THE catalyst as it has been portayed(look up the Design '79 project). The real agents of change were crime prevention, upgrading the stalls, addition of awnings, renovation of the Market Building, building of new parking garages, the expansion of Elmwood Park and many more projects along with the will of Roanokers to make the Market area special again. Center has not drawn enough people in its existence to break even on its operating costs, and must rely on private donors and government funding to exist. To oust EVEN ONE BUSINESS from the downtown area in order to expand Center would be a huge disservice to the REAL reason for our thriving Market area.
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lovenrv on 3/22/2007 9:12:54 AM wrote:
Take this as an opportunity not a crisis. Plans should include 'expanding' the presence of the overall market 'vibe' by creating the market stall covering along one of the areas neighboring streets.
This way you create MORE energy + visibility for the entire area.
There's no reason they should 'go away' because of this project. ROANOKE NEEDS TO LOOK BIGGER IN ITS VISION...NOT SMALLER.
The best example would be the Reading Terminal Market in Philadelphia which almost closed completely when the PA Convention Center, Marriot + other development. Rather than close the market it was upgraded and included in a revised site plan that answered all questions + thrives today as a major tourist + local destination.
Think + plan, don't just react.
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eli2410 on 3/22/2007 9:03:39 AM wrote:
The changes are needed and I think that if people work together there are solutions that could benefit all. Don't get me wrong the farmers and vendors are great and provide an ambience to the Market but they are not everything. The fact that many of these vendors are only there on the weekend or in the summer or on holidays, yet Center is open all year long says to me that folks aren't thinking about the big picture when they say things like "Center should just make due with the entrances it has". Why is it every time someone has a new idea in this town, people are ready to shoot it down. Why can't Roanoke be a place that figures out how to make it happen, rather than a place that continues to say "it won't work here."
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thoward on 3/22/2007 9:02:30 AM wrote:
Don't do it. The vendors are what make the Market so vibrant and exciting. The Art Museum Board fell under the spell of the exotic and let their egos run away. Don't let the Center Board make the same mistake. Having been close to the Center since its inception I would hate to see its expansion cause a loss of the character of the market, which is exactly what would happen if the vendors are replaced.
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shoppinglady2002 on 3/22/2007 6:25:55 AM wrote:
It seems that everyone is getting away from the real subject here.
I do agree that Roanoke is boring and there is nothing really here to do. However, the subject at hand is the market area that has been around alot longer that Center in the Square. When a person thinks of the city market the first places that come to mind are the RWS and the various merchants (Thomas' Market). I think that Roanoke does need to upgrade, but not to the expense of these businesses.
Center in the Square-do you really need to sacrifice jobs for your own satisfaction? You will be losing the Art Museum soon so there is extra space that will probably sit empty. Please consider the jobs you will be eliminating. You can work with the entrances you already have.
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Connor on 3/20/2007 11:22:40 PM wrote:
Quality of life, whether it is related to traffic, costs of homes, quality of schools, water quality, natural beauty, cultural amenties, sports, jobs, available health care, monster truck shows, etc., is important to this issue of Center in the Square which has been so very effective in improving the Q/L in this region. But Q/L is also related to whether we have a supportive newspaper or one that tries to constantly create news from rumors and little information and tries to pit one group against the other. We can run down the list! Business leaders planning to relocate read newspapers of the communities they are considering. A negative cast projected by the newspaper reduces a community's chance of being selected for new JOBS!
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scottrc on 3/20/2007 2:44:33 PM wrote:
The traffic enough was reason to move back. However there were many things that influenced my decision to come back. And don't get me wrong, I wasn't exactly thrilled with the idea of moving back to Roanoke. I was very happy to leave because I was SO bored when I was 18. I just feel bad for the sucker who bought my house up there at the height of the real estate boom... now he's lost $200K in value. For that amount he lost, I was able to buy a house here in town which actually contains LAND. But I digress, this column is supposed to be about Center in the Square, not a debate of NoVA vs Roanoke. There is no comparison... only differences.
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ziranthia on 3/20/2007 2:00:53 PM wrote:
LOL Scott! I hear ya on that traffic situation. I spend about 2 and a half hours a day in the car, stuck in horrible traffic, and I truly hate it! Prince William Parkway is enough to cause a tension headache.
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scottrc on 3/20/2007 12:46:31 PM wrote:
Quality of Life is subjective. My quality of life improved because I didn't want to pay $20,000 a year in property taxes on my house that was over 3x its actual value, or $3/gallon of gas. There are things I miss, such as the ability to cheaply fly anywhere in the world and the shopping options are much better obviously. But, despite the idiots in this town unable to merge on the interstate or realize the left lane is for passing, I wouldn't trade the level of traffic here for 1/2 of the traffic up there. Roanoke isn't for everyone, and I can only hope it will improve if I stay, but I really think it will take a complete revamp of the conservative town core in order to do so.
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ziranthia on 3/20/2007 12:40:09 PM wrote:
With Carilion, it depends on what type of position you have. The "business" side of Carilion is horrible. The Clinical side; I don't have a clue, and won't comment, but I'm sure that part of Carilion is ok. The "pay grade" system Carilion uses limits advancement potential by dividing hourly and salaried employees, and the wages aren't exactly amazing. Not to mention, more times than not, it is who you know, not what you know. Wachovia (First Union)...nuff said. But anyway, thanks for your post, Walker, and have a good afternoon.
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Walker on 3/20/2007 11:39:03 AM wrote:
My wife works for Carilion, so I know Carilion quite well. Just thought your statement was a bit odd, which is par for your posts.
I agree with the last post, change isn't always a good thing. His perspective sounds like it might need to be observed.
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old_curmudgeon on 3/20/2007 9:03:54 AM wrote:
Having Tom Brock's name associated with this plan should make everyone VERY nervous. Tom made a bunch of changes while he was in charge of the GE plant in Salem. After he was relieved of his duties, most of those changes had to be undone to save what was left of the business. Unfortunately, the parts he changed MOST never did recover. Change is not ALWAYS good. Trust me.
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ziranthia on 3/19/2007 5:52:02 PM wrote:
"I don't even know where to start. Let's see if I can think of something equally insane and irrelevant......nope can't do it."
QUESTION FOR WALKER:
Have YOU ever worked for one of those banks OR Carilion? If not, then trust me, you don't know what you are even saying. I don't even know where to start myself in trying to explain concept of revolving door employment, especially to someone in denial. But that's the problem, isn't it? Denial. As for quality of life; that's a matter of opinion. I disagree with the opinion that the quality of life is better in Roanoke than NOVA. The standard of living is certainly much higher in NOVA, as are the wages and property values. :)
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Walker on 3/19/2007 5:37:17 PM wrote:
"I would like to see a major college set foot and grow IN ROANOKE"
Your right...it isn't going to happen.
Glad to have you back Scott, also happy to see that you noticed our quality of life and its superiority to NOVA's. ;)
Z-
"Banks are horrible, and Carilion is much worse."
I don't even know where to start. Let's see if I can think of something equally insane and irrelevant......nope can't do it.
Let me try anyways, here we go....Roanoke Cinemas are rectangular, making them a hateful vehicle for sleeping on.
Still doesn't quite cut it....
Z, I think the wine has bled into whats left of your noggin. Have a fabulous day!
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GetALife on 3/19/2007 5:24:21 PM wrote:
Thank you Motherof2! Why does the Roanoke Times LOVE to stir up trouble on NON-issues? I LOVE the opening line: "The Roanoke City Market was packed Saturday with green attire and emerald lettuce, but many of the vendors and customers were seeing red." I can't say I saw comments from anyone "seeing red!" The Roanoke Times, along with everyone else, needs to relax and wait to see the ACTUAL PLAN! This is still just a concept!
Does anyone remember what the Market was like BEFORE Center moved in? Things have improved quite a bit down there since then. They've improved things before, and they can do it again. Let's all take a step back, give Center in the Square a break and wait to see the final plan.
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ziranthia on 3/19/2007 4:27:56 PM wrote:
Good post, Scott! Thanks for your honest opinion. It's refreshing to see people who are aware of Roanoke's shortcomings, because they have indeed lived elsewhere. You hit the nail on the head when you named job opportunities in Roanoke. Banks are horrible, and Carilion is much worse. I doubt any amount of progress is going to reverse trends that have been ongoing in Roanoke for half a century now. I'm trying to imagine what would drive someone from NOVA BACK to rural SW VA. You must have lived in Arlington. I live in Lake Ridge, and love it here. But to each his own, I guess. Have a good afternoon!
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scottrc on 3/19/2007 4:07:52 PM wrote:
I am one of the many who recently moved back to Roanoke after living in NoVA since 94. The quality of life improvement coming down here is immense, probably more so than Ziranthia thinks. I was shocked at the level of development that has occurred in the past 12-13 years, but still Roanoke is way behind the curve. I would like to see Roanoke progress and yet still remain small. I would like to see a major college set foot and grow IN ROANOKE (not blacksburg) to keep younger people in town instead of forcing them out after graduation due to lack of variety of jobs (unless you want to work for Carilion or any of the banks) This will never happen with all the ancient people around here who are so scared of change.
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ziranthia on 3/19/2007 10:10:36 AM wrote:
Walker, you are entitled to your opinion, just as anyone else is, and all opinions are valued. That is what makes message boards good catalysts. I'm glad that you and others are happy with Roanoke. As long as someone is happy, that is all that matters. The only thing I don't like is "off the cuff" remarks that are made without any proof to back them up. All these people who are moving back in droves. Who are they? and most importantly, where are all these people finding gainful employment? I would love to know. When looking at sources like the newspaper and Monster.com, all i seem to see is Call Center and Customer Service/$10 deadend positions. I curious how people LIVE on such little income.
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Walker on 3/19/2007 9:22:06 AM wrote:
Well, I have to say that after reading the paper yesterday, my opinion has changed ....slightly. I still don't think businesses should HAVE to move, BUT the Center does own the building and it is their decision alone as to what they want to do.
The ideas they have in place SOUND okay (other than moving businesses). I like the idea of closing off Market street altogether and having vendors in the road as well. I dont see it happening however...plans seem to change sometimes.
Also, Z? You are ridiculous. Why are you so afraid of people living here and loving it?
There is a false premise out there that we ALL want Roanoke to change and become some pseudo-European cultural mecca....it's a lie. Growth is good, sometimes, I personally, like Roanoke the way it is.
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motherof2 on 3/18/2007 7:24:31 PM wrote:
How ridiculous of the Roa.Times!! Trying to stir people up based on false assumptions. And they know it!! How many front page stories R they going to run based on "nothing". Center wants to renovate-SO! They are sharing a concept 4 downtown that will attract bus., retain our young, add jobs, and make our Q/L better. NO BUSINESS WILL HAVE TO CLOSE!! They might have to move 30 feet in order to help create a fun filled people place-that is if the City wants to complement the building changes with Market improvements. Center cannot move farmers, close down vendor stalls-they do not own the market square. So folks get real! Understand the details and you will not be alarmed. Many want to yell before knowing the details.Grow up obnoxious adults.
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ziranthia on 3/18/2007 3:18:02 PM wrote:
"We have people returning here and moving here in droves for the first time to getaway from the hustle and bustle of big cities!"
Do you have PROOF? I have lived in Northern Virginia since 1993, and will NEVER return to Roanoke, in drove form or otherwise, and know of many people who feel the SAME WAY. I should know, I see them at Tyson's Corner all the time.
Please state your source before making remarks that are false.
Z
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skipbettymitchel on 3/18/2007 2:57:13 PM wrote:
I am 100% opposed to removing the current businesses in the market area to make room for Center in the Square. I work downtown and these businesses are ones I support. They have been a part of the market area too long to just dispose of. I appreciate the fact that we have center in the square and I support it in various ways BUT it doesn't need to expand to take away businesses that bring people into the city. These businesses are open day after day earning money for the city, employing people and bringing people to the market area. The gift shop in the center in the square has never been open when I go to purchase a gift. I see lines at these businesses. I never see continuous lines at Center in the Square. This would be a BIG MISTAKE please keep things as they are.
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billhudson on 3/18/2007 12:55:02 PM wrote:
My gut feeling is they will do what they want, when they want, and how they want. Public input is just the window dressing. “Roanoke Inc.'s board of directors in a meeting closed to the public and news media.” So it’s not much input from the public, so what else is new?
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RutroU on 3/18/2007 12:03:39 PM wrote:
KEEP the Weiner Stand and other Market businesses GET RID of the Science Museum and Center in the Square! There is plenty of space in the area that the city wanted to build a new Football Field that is setting empty. Opps! I forgot another City mess-up. All I have to say is leave Roanoke a hometown like it should be. All these people that are SUPPOSEDLY leaving, do you think it might because they do not like the way things are changing instead of staying the same? We have people returning here and moving here in droves for the first time to getaway from the hustle and bustle of big cities! I eat more hot dogs and buy more items from venders than go to plays and view the science. Besides neither of these places would be in existence if it were not for corporations looking for tax deductions!
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skoobydu on 3/18/2007 10:52:48 AM wrote:
Threats about not going downtown because the weiner stand will be moved juvenile and so typical? This kind of attitude is exactly why Roanoke is stuck in the mud and will never enter the 21st century. Young adults are moving away in droves because no one will allow the city to progress....Grow up people, let the city grow or it will dry up.
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maryzart7 on 3/17/2007 2:49:43 PM wrote:
People go downtown to buy thier vegetables...eat some food, and walk areound, mostly to windowshop. People enjoy the nostalgic feel of the old time market.
I am sorry to say, but the museums are not a big attraction. If people want to go to really good museums they go elsewhere.
I used to live in Raleigh..pretty good museums,and also they were free!
Here, you pay to see a fraction of what is offered elsewhere.
It is not a good idea to uproot buisnesses that have thrived for many years..bad move.
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ChangeIsGreat2008 on 3/17/2007 2:01:41 PM wrote:
Instead of jumping the gun on this issue, why not wait to see what the plans are for Center In The Square. Things may not change as much as you think or as much as The Roanoke Times has led you to believe. Center In The Square is an organization for the community, I'm sure they are not going to change the market and kick out vendors just for the sake of change. Give them a chance. These changes could be good for everyone involved.
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zeke11 on 3/17/2007 1:56:54 PM wrote:
Since the usuem is building a new building and moving, anybody know what is going into it's space?
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jmdoto on 3/17/2007 12:35:23 PM wrote:
....Make no mistake..if Mr. Sears requires the `Roanoke Wiener Stand` to relocate, our family,friends will never darken the doors of the market building...period !
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patsy34 on 3/17/2007 11:46:20 AM wrote:
The Roanoke Farmers Market is one of the real attractions in Roanoke. It is unique and unusual and should be kept that way. It is a big drawing card for the local people and tourists so why try to do away with part of it? Is a "splashy" entrance to Center In the Square going to draw people to downtown Roanoke? The Market area is one of the recreational areas in the city that is booming! Do we need another restaurant on the market at the expense of market vendors and the Roanoke Weiner Stand? I do hope the City of Roanoke doesn't cave in to the pressure of some "high-powered" citizens. Keep the market as it is!!!
Patsy Utt 3/17/07
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kharris1970 on 3/17/2007 10:42:18 AM wrote:
Conner said that Center draws 500,000 people a year...that would mean every single person in the Roanoke Valley, including Salem, Roanoke County, Vinton and Roanoke City would have to go there at least twice every year to make that number. I don't think your figures are correct. Do some research before posting figures as fact.
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overtheridge65 on 3/17/2007 10:13:28 AM wrote:
My wife Dorothy, a City resident and home owner, and I are regular visitors to the City Market area and our favorite eateie is The Little Dipper. Why would the City want to cut it;s own throat by allowing Center in the Square to eleminate any of the Markets attractions? It is a drawing card that has existed much longer than the Center and should have it's tennants given priority consideration. Any designer or architectural
engineer could give the Center all the room it requires by putting to use much of it's existing "dead" space. Think long City Council! Dan Level
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chatatcha on 3/17/2007 10:01:36 AM wrote:
Center is trying to come up with a plan that will enhance Center and Downtown.Center is not going to shove something on Downtown that the community does not want.There are a few misconceptions on this board.(1) Isn't this the same Roanoke Weiner Stand that complained it was going to have to close a few years ago when they made Campbell Avenue a two way street because they didn't get enough foot traffic? (2) Thousands of people go to Center every year. It has been an anchor of revitalization downtown, whether anyone can remember or recognize that or not. The entrance area could use a facelift. Change can be good. Think what it would be like if the city hadnt taken a change twenty some years ago: adult bookstores & empty storefronts.
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zeke11 on 3/17/2007 9:45:53 AM wrote:
It's a shame that Jefferson St can't be included in some of these plans. It's bit strange that we're talking about displacing highly successful businesses, meanwhile a block away is becoming an "abandoned ghost town." I know there has been an effort to turn some of the buildings into apartments, but the closings seem to be coming faster than the space can be filled. No matter how wonderful they make the market it will be a hard sell if a block away is an abandoned slum. I would hate for the city advertsing to have to be "Come see Center in the Square just keep your eyes closed on the way in."
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Connor on 3/17/2007 9:22:59 AM wrote:
Those shown the plans, concepts, or whatever they are, about the farmers and market generally agree that there are ideas worth considering. Naturally, people not yet included in the briefings are reserved or directly hostile. My goodness, I recall in 1980 when people were opposed to the revitalization efforts of the market area, Center in the Sq., Elmwood Park and so on. I don't believe those leading the Center want to do away with the farmers, market, or hurt anyone. They are floating ideas that might increase downtown visitors, farmer sales, and the health of the local economy. Naturally they want to improve their museums too as many here have noted are outdated--yes, maybe by 25 years. Give Science some money so they but new exhibits!
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zeke11 on 3/17/2007 12:11:33 AM wrote:
When you visit the Museum of U.S. History in
D.C. they have a working soda shop. Maybe the Weiner Stand could be incorporated as part of the history museum. It's certainly a piece of Roanoke history.
One thing I'm curious to see is how the rest of the farmers market is handled in the new plans. Driving by, you can't even really see Sumdat, the Little Dipper, or Thomas Market because the farmers stalls are in front of them. I wonder if they will also have to be moved.
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wineslr on 3/16/2007 10:17:09 PM wrote:
I just want to set the record straight, the reason Wertz's isn't affected by Center In the Square is because Center does not own Wertz's or Orvis building.
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Connor on 3/16/2007 8:56:03 PM wrote:
Here we go. Commenting on things we know little about. Center on the Square is in the conceptual stage and not even the planning stage. Rather than hostile, we could be appreciative that they are sharing concepts about 2 years before any construction is to begin. Perhaps their eventual design will further enhance business for the farmers and retailers like the WS. They do OWN the building and the spaces and can do what they want when leases are up. Yet they are seeking input. A lot of you guys are arguing about who goes there. 500,000 people go there per year--are they all elitest or are they our kids, grandkids, spouses and tourists bring income to the City. Oh, they are private, not gov. Their presence saved the market for us.
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shoppinglady2002 on 3/16/2007 8:41:39 PM wrote:
I have been to the Science museum twice in the last 2 years. None of the exhibits have changed and it is really boring. I have actually enjoyed the Children's Science Museum in Richmond better. It has more hands on and is bigger.
Center in the Square has no other excuse than trying to run out long time businesses. Honestly, I think they are in danger of closing due to low attendance to the various museums. I don't think spending millions of dollars to change the entrance will help. I think they may have even lost their state funding.
It really wouldn't bother me to see the Center close. They do nothing for Roanoke.
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zeke11 on 3/16/2007 5:51:42 PM wrote:
Something else I think is interesting is that apparently fruit stands, an ice cream shop, and the Weiner stand may have to move, but what about Wertz's and Orvis? Last time I checked they were on the front of the same building. I guess they are more representative of the type of consumer Center in the Square hopes to attract. I bet more Center in the Square visitors make purchases at the Weiner Stand, Little Dipper, Thomas Market, or Sumdat than at Orvis or Wertz's. Maybe the Weiner stand should sell their hot dogs for $10 each, then they would be considered "elite" enough not to be in danger of moving.
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scottrc on 3/16/2007 5:30:10 PM wrote:
Those that will go to that museum will go no matter its location since it is more a niche entertainment location, but those that choose for expanded shopping/eating are more a fickle bunch, unwilling to travel distances to get the goods. The Museum building could become a very great consumer center. I hate to use the term mall because of its negative connotation, but A couple nice restaurants, perhaps a better place for live music than the other dives in the area, and some entertainment will give people a place to go instead of being bored. Another thing that would be nice would be to convert the market square parking lot into space that would enhance community, instead of making it easier to park. That's what the garage is for!
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scottrc on 3/16/2007 5:22:37 PM wrote:
Having grown up in town I have seen the downtown market area very slowly evolve. I went to the center in the square museum and planetarium as a grade schooler and have fond memories of the place. However, it is turning out that the area the the museum is housed is prime real estate. But how many actually use the museum as opposed to the surrounding eateries and shopping options? I'd bet not as many as the vocal minority would think. I think we as citizens NEED the museum and planetarium, but we also need to foster growth and expansion rather than putting bandaids on a gaping wound.
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zeke11 on 3/16/2007 5:00:22 PM wrote:
I wonder if the problem is really the outside look of Center in the Square or the fact that the museums inside tend to be lacking. If you were to visit the History Museum, Science Museum, or Art Musuem today and then to return in 6 months the changes in exhibits would be so minimal that you would have little reason to return again. A trip to the Science Museum a few months ago found that it contained a lot of interactive exhibits, but most of them were broken or didn't work properly. When people have these kind of experiences why would they come back. Maybe the whole Center should move into the new art museum building and it's current space should be turned into downtown retail space. A nice mall would bring more patrons than the Center.
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Walker on 3/16/2007 4:15:19 PM wrote:
"I am trying so hard to understand this town's adversity to change when attempting to enhance our quality of life."
Hence, the crux of the issue. How does it "enhance our quality of life?"
It doesn't, for me at least.
Why move (inconvenience/handicap/pemalize) an establishment that is successful, and loved, in order to bail out (in my eyes) one that is historically a failure?
This is a perfect example of the Vocal minority pissing in everyone else's cornflakes for the sake of "Enlightenment".
See, those of us arguing against the move are just oafish simpletons, who couldnt possibly understand the value of the "Fine Arts". We actually like Roanoke the way it is, what do we know.
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tryinghard on 3/16/2007 3:41:37 PM wrote:
I am trying so hard to understand this town's adversity to change when attempting to enhance our quality of life. The Roanoke Weiner Stand IS a great place to grab a hot dog but I wonder, honestly, how many of you actually eat there? The proposal is to move the WS to the other side of the street AND to stay on Campbell. If you can't walk an extra 20 feet to get your hot dog, then something is wrong with you. Try and think about making Roanoke a better place to live, work and raise families...not a place that is stagnant, boring and becoming a high retiree community. If you want to do something for Roanoke, stop being so close-minded, pessimistic and be positive, constructive with your criticism and make this city a place to be proud.
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GeorgiaBoy on 3/16/2007 11:32:22 AM wrote:
There's a lot of culture they can experience in the Market Square all right....grab a dog from the Weiner Stand...sit on a bench in the square...and watch all the culture walk by. Renovate all they like...but leave the Weiner Stand alone...nostalgia and tradition is built by time, experience, and...just as important...location. Who was it that said, "location, location, location"? I personally believe that if you move something that has been in place for a long time then it no longer has a nostalgic value. I like nostalgia...and the things that go with it. Some people would have us believe that 'old is bad'..that we need to 'modernize'. I'm with Walker....'Bah(humbug)!
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Walker on 3/16/2007 11:11:30 AM wrote:
Amen to that. Does Center receive any monies from the city just for "being"? Subsidies so to speak?
I know the schools visit occasionally, this is a form of that.
If so, the city needs to knock it off. I dont want another dime from me going to the place after this nonsense.
If you cannot get the business yourself, you dont deserve it. Period. And the people out there who are trying to force this BS culture/enlightenment crap down our throats need to take a look around.
"Students NEED these things, they NEED the museum to EXPERIENCE true culture"
Get a real job.
Bah!
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croakingtoad on 3/16/2007 9:37:36 AM wrote:
kharris has a good point. The Roanoke market is defined by its vendors, unfortunately not the museums or Center in the Square. There is a vocal minority who regularly make use of the Center's museums, etc. but by and large the most frequented places downtown are the food vendors and other merchants on the market.
Moving the hot dog stand, et al would not only hurt their business but likely kill their regular patronage.
It's time for the silent majority in Roanoke to get off their collective rear ends (self included) and protest the silly decisions that are made around here.
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kharris1970 on 3/16/2007 6:10:20 AM wrote:
Center in the Square's and DRI's cavalier attitude about the possible eviction of the Weiner Stand and other Market businesses shows their lack of respect for the Market vendors as a whole. The truth is that more people frequent these businesses than they do the museums in Center. The success of the Weiner Stand is tied to its food and its location. Any change in location that may put it in a less convenient spot will kill its business. The same can be said for the other Market vendors in the building. Center will be burning a lot of bridges with this community if the Weiner Stand does not survive a move. I hope they know how to tighten their belts, because their donations might drop and their attendance...well their attendance is pitiful anyway.
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